Can Riley and staff keep up with the new wave of Pac-12 coaches?
I'm afraid we already know the answer to that question, given Chip Kelly's dominance over Mike Riley since Kelly's arrival in 2009. But for the sake of conversation (and the sanity of Beaver fans), we have to at least entertain the possibility that Riley and his colleagues will adjust their decrepit system to contend with the revitalized offenses expected from Mike Leach (Washington State), Rich Rodriguez (Arizona), and whoever replaces Rick Neuheisel (UCLA) and Dennis Erickson (Arizona State; Houston's Kevin Sumlin is the preferred choice), and that they will mount an effective offensive charge against these and other opponents.
Fortunately, the Beavs won't face Sacramento State in 2012! Unfortunately, they won't face USC, either. OSU's win over USC last year shocked coach Lane Kiffin, and it showed that the elder Riley is capable of defeating a young whippersnapper coach once in awhile. But once in awhile won't be often enough when team after team led by young, innovative coaches fire away at the Beavers in coming seasons.
So what should Riley do to keep himself and his team from being left behind by the new wave of Pac-12 coaches, not to mention the rest of the conference? Come on, readers, share your ideas below. Maybe Riley will read them and take heed.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of SB Nation or the Building the Dam staff. FanPost opinions are valued expressions of opinion by passionate and knowledgeable Oregon State fans.
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I'm excited for Arizona, WSU, and the rest of the Pac12....
On a whole, this season has been dismal for the conference, what with a 6-6 UCLA team being the best the South has to offer (with SC’s probation) and the fact that, for some teams, it looked hopeless that they would ever field a credible contender in the near future.
But both the ’Cats and Cougs dramatically improved their fortunes by hiring coaches previously unavailable to teams mired in the lower end of the Pac 10 Conference. My, what $21 Million will buy! Suddenly 2 of the brightest offensive minds are added to a conference that already has CK in Eugene. And things will only continue to improve.
Keep up or drown.
While this is extremely positive for the Pacific Conference, for a Beaver fan though, the implications are terrifying.
OSU’s braintrust decided to keep Mike Riley. I would approve of that decision if there was talk coming out of Corvallis from both Riley and the AD’s office about how changes are necessary to bring this program back to a competitive level. But I (maybe I missed it) have heard nothing at all from De Carolis – no word that expectations have not been met and he’s expecting improvement in 2012, and nothing from MR – no word that he’s shaking up his staff or bringing in anyone with new ideas.
There seems to be no sense of URGENCY coming out of Corvallis.
And that placid, ’don’t worry, be happy!’ attitude is going to spell a nightmare for the fans. No longer will WSU and Arizona be games that should be competitive for Riley. Instead, those schools will, in the near future, field teams that are suddenly competitive with the Ducks! Which is terrific for those of us who love college football. There are going to be some terrific football games on the horizon. I just don’t see any of them involving Oregon State.
Falling behind now will only make it that much more difficult to catch back up later. The Pac 10 for the last few seasons and now this year’s Pac 12 has seen some truly bad football teams. 16% of the Conference’s teams have now improved their product. Should UCLA and ASU luck into hiring good coaches (I wouldn’t hold my breath for either of them – both have incompetent AD’s at the helm) 33% of the Conference will be greatly improved. And what is OSU’s plan to keep up? I’m afraid no one really has an answer.
I hope I’m wrong about OSU’s fortunes going forward.
hey just give Riley sometime (as if we had a choice)
because either he’ll pull things together or his five years will be up and the beavers can then afford to hire a new coach, notice I did not say fire because De Carolis would just retire Riley and I’m sure that is the way it would be presented to the fan base; they’ll not have to buy him out at that point. So then one has to ask why does not Riley change his systems of play. I think there are a few different reasons why, I understand that many have talked about them but hey I’ll just present them in my way.
1. Riley is to nice to fire his oc and dc.
Let look at the D for Evidence of this first; this can be truly seen in the truly inability that this D has stopping a qb with lags. I mean the only way that this d could stop a qb scramble is if that qb was in a wheel chair and even then I’m not total sure they could, no offence to those in wheel chairs intended. Look there are teams out there that when they play the beavers put in wild cat plays or some sort read option just when they play the beavers because they know that the D can’t stop it therefore there is a clear problem with the system because even when the beavers had OK LB players, for example 08, 09, they could still not stop these sort of plays. I’m not expert of the game nor do I pretend to be and I didn’t stayed at a holiday inn, but even I can see this. I get very tired of seeing games in person and watching the D getting beat by read option and or some sort of ruining qb play over and over again. Add this to the secondary inability to look for the ball and getting PIs the D and the system needs to change. I do have to say that the D this year did sometimes keep this team in games because of the inability of the O.
Now let us take a look at the O. Has it has not come to a surprise that this Offence has become very stale and very predictable. I know that the O line get a lot of heat but I truly believe it all begins there. I mean three walk on are starters on this team come on I understand finding diamonds in the rough but come one three please that just does not seem right. Next, there is not much the QB can do when the other team knows that that there is not any treat of the run so why even try to defend it. The beavers don’t run a run and shoot offence or anything like an al TT or other four wide sets. So they know that the passing game is not going to be that good either therefore the O is always facing third and longs and in pro set this just does not work out well, heck in any system this does not work out will. Even when they would run the ball the running backs are just too young to produce much or the one that does have promise just fumbles it away. There for know what the beavers have to work with way did not the OC take this into account and change the system to better suit the team. Therefore, the only logical reason here is Riely is just too nice to change is OC and DC because they certainly don’t want to change because if it were not for a pair of brothers this team would be worse off than then they could have been.
2. Riley truly believes his system does do work.
Riley must believe these systems does work just look at his comments that everything is ok and they are working hard to get better. I guess he has these feelings because just two years ago his team was playing for the roses but a lot has changed over these years and in the big game to get this team to the rose the team did lose to a team that runs the system that this team just can’t beat. And with two more coach that run fast paces Os come in means there are even more teams Offence that this team can’t stop.
I think that the O can turn it around and become good again but that D even with good athletes seems it can’t beat these types of offences. I mean how many years now has this team been killed by the read option and running QBs so it just can’t be talent leave alone.
oh, them beavers
sorry about the length I just got going.
I think it is time for our OC and DC to move on to being head coaching at another leave therefore, allowing Riley to replace them. Either this or Riley will “retire” in five years and OSU will be looking for new coach anyways. Thus, to answer to the question either Riley will understand it is not the 2000s anymore and his systems (OC/DC) has to change or he’ll needs to retire so the fan base can remember him fondly rather than bring this team back to the old days of losing seasons after losing seasons. But hey, I hope he proves me wrong and this team comes out on top in 2013. Because I just think that this team will still be growing up in 2012 and it will not be good either. What Do I know I’m just a fan
oh, them beavers
Its not a simple problem
and a single silver bullet won’t solve it.
Andy Wooldridge, andy_wooldridge@yahoo.com
BuildingTheDam.Com
Go Beavs!
If Riley and Banker and Langsdorf are still running the show 5 years from now...
OSU might as well retire from the Pacific Conference when MR retires – because the Beavers will be so far down they’d have a tough time competing in the Mountain West.
Change had better come long before then.
But we’ll see what 2012 brings. Maybe an 8-4 team that’s still very young and suddenly I (and a few others of you) will look like bozos.
Actually, I’d be happy to look like a bozo and cheer on Riley and Langsdorf and Banker as they win the Pac12 North title and play Arizona for the Conference Title.
by ConfofChamps on Dec 1, 2011 10:56 PM PST up reply actions
These latest additions, and the ones ASU and UCLA are striving to make,
as well as Kelly at UofO, Sarkisian at UW, and Kiffen at USC, have all been aimed at increased speed, quickness (not the same, but related), AND creativity. I’d even categorize Embree at Colorado this way, though they have a long way to go with their personnel. But at least they have a vision and direction.
This is why I’m especially concerned about Riley’s contention that a different direction with his staff isn’t needed. It is true that they have won with the current coordinators, and their systems. And no, Mark Banker didn’t “forget” how to coach. But he’s playing a dramatically different game now.
A key issue is that Banker’s defensive scheme, when successful, was facing far more 3 and 4 man routes, and far fewer 5 man routes. Teams kept a TE and an RB in to block with some regularity, but they now have a different breed of offensive linemen, and a different timetable for throws, which allow more receivers into the pattern.
The fastest player on the opposing offense was usually at receiver, and that too has changed. Consider the speed of backs currently. A defense that used to work because the linebackers could all run with the opponents’ running backs is no longer a possibility, even if the Beavers are more lucky at recruiting.
You could afford to force backs out away from their blockers when you could catch them. It made sense to get backs away from their blockers. As we have seen, if you “force” LaMichael James, Isi Sofele, John White IV, or Chris Polk, and backs of their ilk to come, out into the open, you won’t catch them, and explosion plays will result.
And the mobility of quarterbacks, both the running ones, and the ones who merely move to throw, or run only when necessary, is dramatically improved. All defenses have an area that can be exploited, and Banker’s scheme always allowed open space for a mobile quarterback. But when dealing with the likes of Ryan Leaf, Nate Longshore, and Carson Palmer, there was essentially no risk of that being exploited. Flushing those guys made sense if you could do it. Push Darron Thomas, Andrew Luck, Kellen Moore (non-conference opponents count equally with conference ones since wins and losses all count), or even a Jeff Tuel out into the open and they will destroy any secondary.
An offense that tends to be one dimensional, OR fails to convert a high percentage of opportunities, is in more trouble now than before as well. With opponents’ offenses being more productive than ever, and more than ever being able to score from anywhere, even a top defense will not always get stops.
An offense can not miss field goals, or settle for them very often. It used to be a short run or pass on third down could still be a sound strategy, as a team could play field position, and use 2-3 possessions to piece together a score. And play time of possession. As we have repeatedly seen, offenses that are both faster and faster paced can get more productivity out of less time. The principals that used to work for Danny Langsdorf no longer do, and not because Danny is doing anything so much different, never mind worse. Its that the opponents are doing something very different, putting new, more challenging requirements on his offense.
These are the reasons why schemes as well as personnel have to change, to meet different challenges. So far, there has been no evidence that either Banker or Langsdorf can bring them selves to dramatically change what they are trying to do. Sure, Langsdorf has turned from a sometimes run-oriented oc to a pass-happy one, but look at the overall distribution of the passes, and what they are meant to accomplish. And consider the impact of generally improved speed of opponents defenses.
Riley has shown he still believes doing a better job of what they are trying to do would make the difference. An objective look at how the game is being played compared to how many of Oregon St.’s opponents were approaching the game not so long ago reveals that the circumstances have changed, and that requires a different response, not just a better one of the same type.
Andy Wooldridge, andy_wooldridge@yahoo.com
BuildingTheDam.Com
Go Beavs!
funny how our responses are longer that the article itself
and after your long response I don’t feel so bad lol
oh, them beavers
I do agree with your idea that it seems the game has
just pasted the teams systems. I just hope that these guys will see this and make the need changes or not so that way season tickets will be easier to buy lol
oh, them beavers
If it sounds like a lot of bashing of Riley,
and his staff, its worth remembering that they did win a lot of games, and beat a lot of good opponents, some of them a number of times.
Part of the current problem is a product of the success. Getting beat a lot has prompted some opponents to not just try to improve their game, but to change the equation.
Andy Wooldridge, andy_wooldridge@yahoo.com
BuildingTheDam.Com
Go Beavs!
I agree that yes they did have a lot of good and great years and I thank them for it
but it is not like these problems have only been around during the last two years of losing seasons. Even in 08 and 09 (yes 09 was a close and good game) the beavers got beat by a read option and running QBs this problem has been around for four years now and will continue due to the fact that more and more teams in the pac are going to systems ie zona and now TT with it throwing version and heck who knows who else will be hired. I’ve not given up hope but as Einstein said crazy is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result (or something like that). At some point DC needs to learn how to stop this right this is what they are paid for right? I do like Reilly and think he is a good coach he just needs to step back maybe just a little and see that the O systems has changed and the fly sweep can’t be the only ruining play that works (even if it did work will some of the time this year) this might not in the end be his fault but he does make the big bucks therefore it does come down on him as any leader knows. One balms the general for the battle plan not the foot soldiers.
oh, them beavers
I think damn near everyone associated with OSU football likes and/or respects Mike Riley...
I think everyone on this board would like nothing more than see Riley and his team successful year in and year out. Not so we can cheer a 12-0 team and play for a ‘Natty’ but because Riley is a genuinely good guy who also is a fan of OSU – not just a guy who played and graduated from ’Bama and coached in Canada and somehow got hired at OSU.
I don’t think anyone of us are bashing Riley.
I think there’s a lot of us scratching our heads wondering why there’s no urgency to win.
by ConfofChamps on Dec 1, 2011 11:01 PM PST up reply actions
I love Riley but I also love winning
I hope we don’t have to choose :(
My nightmare scenario next year is 6 wins.
If it’s fewer, we know something needs to change. If it’s more, things are looking back on track. But around 6, and I’d still have no idea how things are going to go. Maybe next year, maybe next year, maybe next year
I'd take a 6-6 season
it would mean post season play and give us some hope for next year after but then again if they came out the next year to fail what would we do then? so in the end I agree
oh, them beavers
Can we suspend Riley's reality distortion field long enough to look at the facts?
- In eleven years of trying, Riley has not led a team to a first-place conference finish, to the Rose Bowl, or to a BCS bowl.
- Five of the eleven were losing seasons overall. (Bottom line: 72-63.)
- Five of the eleven were losing seasons in the conference. (And one was 4-4, so he’s had only five winning Pac seasons! Bottom line: 46-47.)
- Some of those glorious winning seasons that fans remember so fondly don’t seem all that glorious in retrospect — a 7-5, with a win in the Insight Bowl, a couple of 8-5s, with a win and a loss in the Las Vegas Bowl. Whoop-de-doo!
- Riley’s best three years, 2006-2008, resulted in two 9-5s and a 10-4, with two Sun Bowl wins and one Emerald Bowl win. At the end of those three seasons, out of eleven campaigns, Riley’s teams were ranked in the top 25 by one poll or another.
So, if the competition were standing still, the best we could expect from Riley in future years is three seasons out of every eleven with no more than four losses, with three victories in lower-tier bowls, and with three end-of-season top 25 rankings. The other eight seasons out of eleven? Not as much fun. Agonizing at times.
And, of course, the competition is not standing still. They’re replacing coaches, retooling offensive and defensive schemes, recruiting players who can execute those schemes. It’s going to be a lot tougher for Riley to string together three 9-5 or 10-4 seasons in the decade to come, much less to do even better, to finally win a Pac championship and play in the Rose Bowl or another BCS bowl.
Frankly, I don’t have any reason to believe that will happen. Because Riley is stuck in the past, comfortable with his routines, loyal to a fault, accepting of mediocrity, lacking in the ambition, drive, and creativity of his youth. And before you charge me with age discrimination, please understand that compared to me, Riley is a young man. It’s just that he no longer acts like one.
"And, of course, the competition is not standing still."
This is the real crux of the matter. Not surprisingly.
It’s going to take both a better, and a different, brand of ball to even be average.
Ted Miller made the point that not only are institutions paying much more for top tier head coaches, the budget for assistant coaches is being raised significantly, which will be used to assemble brighter and better staffs. I agree with Ted that overall, by 2015 the conference will be playing at a higher level than now.
Even had Oregon St. not blown as many games last year, and gone to a bowl, and then done a better job in the several winnable games they let get away this year, it would still be necessary to be making serious changes going forward.
Andy Wooldridge, andy_wooldridge@yahoo.com
BuildingTheDam.Com
Go Beavs!
I always pictured you as a younger guy
And before you charge me with age discrimination, please understand that compared to me, Riley is a young man. It’s just that he no longer acts like one.
After being a Beaver for so long, I can see why you’re overboard now
You pictured me as a younger guy?
Must be my avatar. I chose it because it’s so flattering to me.
And “fanoverboard” can be taken two ways. Going overboard in enthusiasm for my teams, or jumping overboard as my teams (UCLA, Minnesota, Oregon State, etc.) sink.
BDC is part of the problem, too.
The shadow of the past (28 straight losing seasons) caused BDC to make a really stupid decision regarding Riley’s contract for life. No head coach at the D-1 level should have that type of job security with such an average resume, but what happened in past still clouds current judgement.
You can assume from MR’s contract, that 6-6 seasons and minor bowl games are the expectation or else he would not be rewarded with extensions for those kind of mediocore performances. Kind of ironic that Mike Sherman at A&M was just fired after going 9-4 in 2010 and 6-6 this year, yet those two seasons would have added two more years to MR’s contract.
I really think MR is kind of stubborn at this point in his career and he is going to do it his way, he is rolling the dice that things fall into place enough in 2012 to get to a bowl game next year and quiet everything down. If he has another losing season then BDC has to act or else maybe it is time for BDC to go.

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